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User avatar
By 87jeepwrangler
#39193
My little guy is less than 2 months old at the start of this project, so I'm going to be taking my time on this one. My goal is to keep this thread updated in real time as the build progresses and as i learn and design.

i've spent the last 10 years of my life doing a lot of offroad wheeling and racing, so i have a LOT of experience with designing, building and racing in some of the harshest conditions imaginable. needless to say, this project will probably be way overdesigned and overbuilt. it's just what i'm used to. most of the racing i do, i would categorize as "ultra 4" racing. google it if the name isn't familiar. just for fun, here's a few pics of the car i race too.
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User avatar
By 87jeepwrangler
#39195
the goals of this build are:
  • build a vehicle that will work as a stroller for a while for my little guy (Cayden)
  • the stroller must have an "ultra 4" buggy appearance when finished
  • since Cayden is only 2 months, the buggy will probably have to be remote control at first, and later adapted to be drivable :twisted:
  • sticking with the overbuilt mentality, it must be fast, easy to drive, and durable (no wimpy plastic parts. anywhere.)
although i'm not done designing the buggy, i do have a CAD drawing i've been working on. I've mostly focused on the suspension design, and how it will fit into the vehicle and allow decent suspension geometry and steering geometry. i decided on a 1 link for simplicity, but without the traditional panhard to keep the axle centered (more on that later). the joint for the 1 link will be 3/4" heim joints (worn our extras from the full scale racer).
here's a quick shot of the underside of the buggy as it i see it now
lower.jpg
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since my first 4x4 was a jeep, i'll be sticking with a jeep hood and grill for this project
hoodgrill.JPG
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i modified some mini-bike coilover shocks to remove the sleeve over the shaft to make it look more like a real coilover, and will also be changing out the spring. the stock mini-bike spring rate is 110lbs/in, which is WAY too much. i don't know what springs ill be using yet, but my rough estimates have me looking for some 20-40 lb springs. these shocks will probably get a few other goodies before final install.
coilover.JPG
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the last piece i currently have is the seat. i am using a modified car seat that i chopped to fit a little better into the scale buggy
seat.JPG
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i also have wheels and tires, but forgot to grab a picture of those. they are relatively standard 10" pneumatic tires and wheels. i wanted to keep them small to keep the overall weight of the vehicle manageable. if they look too small as the project progresses, i'll make adjustments. but until then, im sticking with the 10" pneumatics.
User avatar
By 87jeepwrangler
#39196
on to the actual build:

i was finally able to break free into the garage for an hour today to start on this thing. other than the steering, this should be one of most complex pieces of the entire build. this crossmember will be the mounting point for both the front and rear 1 link joints. the joints are 3/4 shank x 5/8 bolt heim joints. when finished, this piece will also alleviate the need for a panhard.

cutting the 2" x 1/8" crossmember to length
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marking the holes
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punching holes for the heim joints, and for dimpling
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closeup of the die
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closeup of the die as it cuts; you can see how if deforms the base material. i usually put the piece in a shop press to flatten it back out after punching
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User avatar
By 87jeepwrangler
#39198
punched holes with their knockouts
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cutting the crossmember to its final length
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dimple die punching
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finished dimpled piece
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finished piece on a 2x4 to make it easier to see
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User avatar
By 87jeepwrangler
#39201
underside of the piece from above
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closeup of the dimples
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heim joints mocked up
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closeup of the joints mounted. these will need correct-width spacers machined and placed on both sides of the heim joint before full movement of the joint will be allowed.
photo 5.JPG
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like i said in the first post, this thread will be a real-time work in progress, and i don't plan on rushing. more updates and explanations will follow as i build. feel free to ask any questions.
User avatar
By Jornum1
#39209
Wow man thats some heavy fab you have going on! Nice to meet you Sat, cant way to see where this goes.

Are you planning to have this done for spring? Just be careful with the little guy and too much bumping around. Let me know if you need some help/advice with the RC.
User avatar
By 87jeepwrangler
#39310
thanks for the kind words.

Jornum, i'll definitely keep in mind the fragile kid factor, thanks for the reminder. as hard as it will be, i'll keep it to SLOW speeds only until he is ready. And yes, should be done by spring, although i'm not putting a timeline on this project. i spent a bit of time today researching steering controls, and it sounds like this will be one of the most time consuming or expensive aspects of the project. there really isn't an ideal inexpensive solution to the steering. sounds like the servocity setup might just be the best bang for your buck in terms of ready made solutions. i like their option better than all the others. if i could source some gears, i might try building my own version of their setup. time will tell on that one.

on a side note, harbor freight is selling their 10" pneumatic tires right now for $3.99 if you are on their mailing list. i think i'll be going and grabbing a few more of those.

Image
User avatar
By Jornum1
#39316
i wasnt trying to be a bummer, I just remember when I wanted put my son a a bike seat to ride with me most places say they should be a minimum of a year old if I remember correctly. Babies necks are super fragile when they are that young. Once the get to 2 your good to go, it amazes me on a daily basis what my son does to himself and just brushes it off. I am sure we all have those stories though!

If you go with the servo city setup, do yourself a favor and go with the beefier 7995 servo setup. I just feel that the 805 like I have doesnt have as much torque as I would ideally like. Especially if you will be off road. On the pavement its much easier, but on grass, dirt, rocks it lacks a little.
I am tempted to buy the 7995 and adapt it to my gearbox as it more then doubles the torque output. I also have a idea for a fly by wire steering setup as well, but its only a idea at this point.
User avatar
By 87jeepwrangler
#39424
i got another hour in the garage tonight, but it didn't get me very far. i was going to try to make the part of the suspension that centers the axle. on a typical 1 link suspension you'de probably see a panhard bar to keep the axle under the vehicle. the two things i don't like about a panhard are that it allows the axle to swing side to side throughout the suspension cycle, and that it adds clutter and extra parts where i don't want them. in reality, the side to side movement is a non issue on this vehicle, as high speed handling characteristics are not even a thought (there will never be any high speed). the clutter factor, however, bothers me so my approach will be a little different. my plan is to build an axle locating hoop (for lack of a better term) for each axle. these hoops will be located about 6 inches behind the heim joint. if you look at the drawing, you should be able to see how the hoops should allow typical suspensin cycling, but not allow the axle to have any side movement. the biggest advantage i see to this system is the simplicity - lack of extra heims and bracketry.
panhard mockup.jpg
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at this time, i'm thinking about using 3/8" solid round for the hoops. to start making them, i cut a short piece of 3/4" solid rod (similar OD to the pipe i'll be using for the 1 link). i used this piece of 3/4" round in the press to try to bend the 3/8" round into the hoop. at first i thought the piece came out pretty good, until i looked closer. the problem is the two sides are not exactly parallel. they vary in width throughout the length of the hoop (both larger and smaller). the problem is the outer "V" die i used. because the outer die wasn't exactly the correct width for the piece of 3/8 + 3/4 + 3/8, i had to finish bend it in a vice. probably the last 5 degrees. this process is probably what made it "wavy". you can't see it in the pics, it's only out less than a 1/16" throughout the length, but that's too much for my liking. here's the pic of the first attempt:
photo 1.JPG
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on to plan B. i attempted to use a hossfeld bender to bend the 3/8. i used a 3/4" center pin with a piece of 1/2" pipe (the link material i plan on using, which has an OD of .8xx thousandths)to bend around, which made a really nice bend. the sides are perfectly parallel throughout the entire length of the hoop. the bad news is that the link fits perfectly into the end loop part of the bend, but is then a little loose throughout the entire length of the loop. on the third bend, i used a 3/4" center pin without the 1/2" pipe sleeve in hopes of keeping the parallel lengths a little closer together. while that did work almost perfectly, now the pipe won't slide all the way into the loop part of the hoop.

here's a pic of the 3rd bend in the bender
photo 2.JPG
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all 3 hoop attempts:
#1 is "wavy"
#2 is too loose (although it doesn't look it in the pic)
#3 is perfect along the straights, but the 1/2" pipe only goes "in" as far as you see it in the pic
photo 3.JPG
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my options as i see them:
  • go back to method #1, and weld up a V die that is exactly the correct width to allow the bending process to complete in 1 shot in the press, and not have to finish bend it by hand in a vice.
  • machine a delrin spacer that slides over the 1/2" pipe link to make up for the extra slop. this will create a nice quiet finished product, but the problem will still remain that the link with delrin spacer still won't slide all the way into the end of the loop.
  • start over and just weld some pieces of metal parallel at the correct width, ditch the fancy loop end, and stop being so anal.
not sure what i'm gonna do yet. i'll have to think it over.
User avatar
By Jornum1
#39428
If it were me and tolerance is a issue. It seems you have machining capabilities why not just use a piece of steel stock at your desired thickness(3/8"?) and just mill your slot out with a 3/4" end mill? This would give you the consistency your looking for to enable the shaft to travel like you want.

Just a quick sketchup to for a visual aide. Not to scale or even centered! Just for reference.

Image
User avatar
By Jornum1
#39430
btw I mention that because my gaucho build is heading in a similar direction. as far as the steering if your planning on going full rc, the steering should actually be pretty straight forward. I have a idea for mine to have fly by wire power steering.
User avatar
By Jornum1
#39442
Oh of course, just didnt want to jack your thread. I have no problem sharing at all. Thats what these sites are all about IMO.

Its nothing revolutionary, just some ideas I got from converting the RC esc over to manual pedal control.
I have similar goals as you. I want to make my Gaucho SP a serious all terrain vehicle for my son. Doesnt have to be fast, just strong and rugged.

Ok so here goes...
With a straight front axle the steering is pretty simple, just a arm linking the two wheels like any other PW, but with one of the servo gearboxes installed to manipulate it instead of a column. I am probably going to upgrade to the larger 7995 servo. I can get almost triple the torque out of it. Its digital so you can program it for 180 degree rotation easily.

Then this gearbox can be controlled by a manual servo controller as I did with the esc. Its plug and play so no setup or calibration needed.

Image

Your steering column would have to be cut short and stabilized with some bearing or however you choose. Set up some stops at say 45 degrees in each direction.
Then its just a matter of attaching some sort of way to synchronize your steering column to the knob. I was thinking some plastic #25 chain and sprockets. A 1:1 ratio would probably work, but would have to see once its mocked up. Plastic chain and sprockets are cheap and there is no load on them so no need for steel really.

So like what I have now, but with the servo controller being in place of the actual servo in this picture.

Image

The best part about it is by just switching one plug you can go from RC to manual. Just remove the plug from the servo tester and plug it into your rc receiver. With my esc setup its basically the same thing.
So my goal is to be able to easily switch between the two by just moving two servo plugs.

Hope that makes sense!
User avatar
By 87jeepwrangler
#39507
awesome idea. i love it.

i think i get everything you are saying. basically the steering column turns the knob on the test controller. the test controller is wired to to a steering servo, which is connected to the tie-rod. no mechanical linkage between the steering column and steering on the axle. sound about right?

the idea sounds awesome and relatively simple. it's been a few years since i built my RC crawler, so im a little fuzzy on the wiring of everything, but will the servo draw too much for the test controller? or is there a way to wire a separate power supply for the servo?

instead of gears and a chain to connect the test controller to the column, couldn't you just have the column end directly into the potentiometer on the controller and eliminate the extra gears and chain all together?

the only real pitfall i see is that when driving the car in RC mode, the steering wheel won't turn by itself. i originally wanted that option, but maybe not even anymore.
User avatar
By Jornum1
#39529
87jeepwrangler wrote: it's been a few years since i built my RC crawler, so im a little fuzzy on the wiring of everything, but will the servo draw too much for the test controller? or is there a way to wire a separate power supply for the servo?.
I honestly dont know? On most servos you can run 4.8 or 6v to them. Obviously 6v yielding more power. I was thinking of running a separate 6v battery to power the servo, but not sure how the controller will handle it. I just looked up the manufacturer, maybe I will send over a email to them.

Servo city also sells a controller which is used more for robotic applications instead of just "testing". It may be able to handle the load better. I will shoot them a email as well.

87jeepwrangler wrote:
instead of gears and a chain to connect the test controller to the column, couldn't you just have the column end directly into the potentiometer on the controller and eliminate the extra gears and chain all together?
I thought that might be a possibly too, just didnt know if there would be any need for gear reduction between the two.
Because if you hooked it up right to the column you would be probably 45 each way to full turn. I am hoping to have a pretty good turn in on the steering with the 180 rotation servo for low speed all terrain navigation. I wasnt sure if ratio would need to be reduced for real time steering. You dont want the little guy rolling because he yanked the wheel full turn at speed. Ideal would be maybe 90-120 degrees each way I would think? Again this is just speculation, its something I will have to tackle once everything is mocked up.

87jeepwrangler wrote:
the only real pitfall i see is that when driving the car in RC mode, the steering wheel won't turn by itself. i originally wanted that option, but maybe not even anymore.
Right, some kind of resistance will have to be built in so it doesnt have such a video game effect. The other option is hook the column up to the steering on the same principal and have the servo "assist". then its more like a real time power steering. But then you run into the issue of how to hook up the steering with the suspension you want.

Never said it would be easy!
User avatar
By Jornum1
#39530
Come to think of it. I like the idea of the power assisted method.
hooking up the steering wouldnt be that hard. If you had a universal joint to handle the suspension travel, and then some sort of keyed sleeve on the column to handle the little bit of up and down travel. Not the hardest thing in the world to accomplish.
User avatar
By 87jeepwrangler
#39770
my wife took Cayden out to a friends house for a little bit, so i had just enough time to work in the garage. i decided to stick with the 3/8" rod for the axle locating hoop. a machined piece would be more precise, but i really like the look of the hoop design. plus, i feel like i can get the hoop design from above to work if i massage them a little more. that being said, i got the main crossmember almost finished. just need to finish and weld the axle locating hoops on. on to some pics...


little man:
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some 3/4" x 1/8" bar stock bent and cut to length:
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the 3/4" bar stock TIG'd to the crossmember:
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inside view. i didn't weld the inside, you're just seeing the penetration here:
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heims sitting in place for mock up.
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User avatar
By 87jeepwrangler
#39783
drilling and tapping the main tube for the 1 link:
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almost complete crossmember:
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closeup of a 1 link tube in place, threaded onto the heim:
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closeup of how the link will ride in the axle locating hoop. the hoop is not welded in place yet, and is probably about twice as long as it needs to be right now. i will machine a piece of delrin to sleeve the pipe and ride in between the hoop to keep it quiet and smooth as the suspension moves.
photo 4.JPG
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User avatar
By Jornum1
#39786
Wow that looks great. I am interested how your going to make the axles and linkage. Just brain looking for some ideas, it seems like you have a lot of experience doing this. My knowledge is more on two wheels then 4, especially off road.
User avatar
By 87jeepwrangler
#39819
Jornum1 wrote:Wow that looks great. I am interested how your going to make the axles and linkage. Just brain looking for some ideas, it seems like you have a lot of experience doing this. My knowledge is more on two wheels then 4, especially off road.
thanks. i have a few cool ideas for the axle and linkage. not exactly sure how i want to implement them yet, so i think im gonna move on to the chassis design and come back to the links.

Iam0014 wrote:where did you get your link end from?
the heim joints are used from our racer. when they start to show excessive wear, squeek, or just have been in too long, we replace them. needless to say, we have a stock pile of about 30 extra heim joints that we no longer deem appropriate for racing. the ones im using in this build are older FK rod ends, model #RSMX10T. They are 3/4" x 5/8" rod ends, and bring about $40 each new. If i were to pick up rod ends for this project, i would never spend the $ on nice FK rod ends. in fact, if i were to spec rod ends for this project, they wouldn't be 3/4 x 5/8 rod ends at all. I'd choose something much smaller. this is just what i had around.

edit:
just looked them up. the static load rating on these heims is 40,590 lbs. should be plenty for my stoller build :D
we use these for steering. we use much bigger joints for the suspension on our car.
Last edited by 87jeepwrangler on Sun Oct 09, 2011 7:20 pm, edited 2 times in total.
User avatar
By 87jeepwrangler
#39824
for the chassis, i want to try to keep the tubing to scale with a full size racer. we most commonly use 1.75" OD tubing for the chassis builds, and since this stroller project is approximately 40% of a full scale buggy, the math comes out to ~.7" OD tube for this project. after a bit of searching and researching, i decided on using 1/2" EMT, which is almost exactly the right size. There are plenty of reasons NOT to use EMT for a project like this, but i just couldn't resist. The price and availability is too good to pass up.


PROs:
Super cheap $2 for 10', versus $2/ft for similar size DOM or HREW tubing
available anywhere and anytime
light weight

CONs:
EMT is galvanized, and therefore toxic when heated or welded.
EMT is also not the best grade of metal which could eventually cause fatigue and cracking throughout the chassis.
EMT is VERY thin and therefore will be hard to weld


how will i build around the CONs? i'll try to design the chassis strong enough so that fatigue isn't an issue. although i'm not the best welder in the world, i have enough time behind a mask that i'm confident i can weld this material and still make it look good. to fight the galvanized problem, i'll hit all metal with a wire wheel before welding to knock the majority of the zinc off, and then use a P100 mask while welding. the zinc oxide comes off as a particulate, and therefore an N95 or P100 mask is adequete to fight zinc oxide poisoning.

test weld on the 1/2" EMT. not bad for my first weld on super thin galvanized tube:
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P100 mask:
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User avatar
By Jornum1
#39838
Thats a interesting idea using EMT. I have also been thinking about the added weight of a steel chassis. While I love the idea of a nice strong chassis, I also dont want it to weight 200lbs. Thats just more weight these plastic gear boxes need to lug around.
Your really making me want to start my chassis seeing all your pics. I need to source my front motor and GB's to see how I want to tackle the steering first.

Keep the pics coming, it looks great so far!
User avatar
By 87jeepwrangler
#39854
Jornum1 wrote:Thats a interesting idea using EMT. I have also been thinking about the added weight of a steel chassis. While I love the idea of a nice strong chassis, I also dont want it to weight 200lbs. Thats just more weight these plastic gear boxes need to lug around.

1/2" EMT weighs .3 lbs / ft
3/4" EMT weighs .46 lbs / ft

my chassis will have almost exactly 50' of tube, and therefore weigh 15 lbs. thats JUST the chassis tho, no axles, tires, wheels, steering, seats, crossmember, batteries etc.
User avatar
By Jornum1
#39856
50 feet? Holy crap! But I guess your building the whole thing from scratch with no PW tub as a base right? So i guess its not as bad as it sounds.
I just posted a thread in the general section about chassis material selection. Wouldnt mind your input.

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=5120
User avatar
By Iam0014
#39894
Iam0014 wrote:where did you get your link end from?
the heim joints are used from our racer. when they start to show excessive wear, squeek, or just have been in too long, we replace them. needless to say, we have a stock pile of about 30 extra heim joints that we no longer deem appropriate for racing. the ones im using in this build are older FK rod ends, model #RSMX10T. They are 3/4" x 5/8" rod ends, and bring about $40 each new. If i were to pick up rod ends for this project, i would never spend the $ on nice FK rod ends. in fact, if i were to spec rod ends for this project, they wouldn't be 3/4 x 5/8 rod ends at all. I'd choose something much smaller. this is just what i had around.

edit:
just looked them up. the static load rating on these heims is 40,590 lbs. should be plenty for my stoller build :D
we use these for steering. we use much bigger joints for the suspension on our car.


ok see i was thinking if you got them cheep enough to use on power wheels, then they wouldn't be $40 :( would you be willing to sell a few of the used ones you have?
User avatar
By 87jeepwrangler
#39928
to be honest, it might be cheaper for you to buy new ones. you'll need large bolts to assemble the ones i have, and a 3/4-16 tap and 11/16 drill bit to thread the links.

if you go to midwestcontrol.com, you can buy non-cromoly rod ends in a more managable size, like 3/8" or 1/2" shank. i would imagine there's a greater chance of you having those size taps. if not, you could easily weld a nut onto the end of a link and thread your rod end in that way.

budget 3/8" & 1/2" rod ends from midwest control are pretty reasonable at $7 or $8 each, and get cheaper quick as you buy higher quantities. go to their site and search product #s MTM-6 and MTM-8 and you'll see what i mean.


as for the chassis design, yes, i have one drawn up. it's a buddy of mine's full size race chassis resized and modified a little to fit the components for this build. the drawing isn't complete, but its got a good bit of detail.
photo 3.jpg
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User avatar
By 87jeepwrangler
#40125
modmom32 wrote:I love this build...I cant stand waiting but I understand... Looking good so far
thanks,

i'm excited myself, but little man takes up all my free time, so i cant usually spend more than 1 hour in the garage every few days. plus i'm supposed to be finishing the upstairs bedrooms and bathroom, not playing in the garage :lol:

spent about half hour today finish cutting and welding a few pieces of EMT. it's definitely right at the limit of my welding skills to weld that stuff without blowing through or making it look like crap. welding .30 thick material is hard.
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By JKMotorsports
#40186
Be careful welding Galv. Tube. Not only are the tubes toxic, but the weld will not penetrate as well as sheilding gas actually aids in penetration and yours is being 75% burnt by the zinc in the Galv.

Best way is to dip the weld areas in Muriatic Acid prior ti welding. Then rince with water and weld. Cemically strips the zinc from the metal and etches it.
User avatar
By Iam0014
#40189
87jeepwrangler wrote:to be honest, it might be cheaper for you to buy new ones. you'll need large bolts to assemble the ones i have, and a 3/4-16 tap and 11/16 drill bit to thread the links.

if you go to midwestcontrol.com, you can buy non-cromoly rod ends in a more managable size, like 3/8" or 1/2" shank. i would imagine there's a greater chance of you having those size taps. if not, you could easily weld a nut onto the end of a link and thread your rod end in that way.

budget 3/8" & 1/2" rod ends from midwest control are pretty reasonable at $7 or $8 each, and get cheaper quick as you buy higher quantities. go to their site and search product #s MTM-6 and MTM-8 and you'll see what i mean.


as for the chassis design, yes, i have one drawn up. it's a buddy of mine's full size race chassis resized and modified a little to fit the components for this build. the drawing isn't complete, but its got a good bit of detail.
The attachment photo 3.jpg is no longer available

thanks for the site and the info. i am planing to build some thing like this with a F150 and its going to be big
greens10_2.jpg
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By JKMotorsports
#40195
Cheap Enough.
http://www.ruffstuffspecialties.com/catalog/12RE.html
I get my 3/4" Steering Rod ends and 1.25" Suspension rod end from here (or a More Canadian Resourse that sellsthe same)
IMO 3/4" is WAY over kill for Anything on this site, but if you have spares why not!

I have a few 1/2" Cromemoly Hiems that I used to get for around 4-5$ a peice left over from when I build Honda race suspensions if your interested. I was keeping them around for shift links on my rigs, but like above I have spare 3/4" and bigger around now.
Last edited by JKMotorsports on Wed Oct 12, 2011 5:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
By 87jeepwrangler
#40218
you can never give too many warnings about welding galvanized tube, so thanks JK. Not worried about penetration with 35 thousands material thickness though. i had considered using muriatic acid to clean the tubes before welding, but decided against it because i wouldn't be able to clean entire lengths, and therefore will still have areas not cleaned that would need welding. plus, using muriatic acid in your garage will rust every piece of metal you have, including your tools. didn't feel like dealing with it, so i just wear the P100 1/2 mask.

Iam0014,
is that the Xtreme truggy Ian built? looks like a cool project. definitely do a build thread, i'd love to see it. 4 wheel drive? 2 passenger? you say big, but what size/scale?

JK,
i completely agree about 3/4" heims being overkill. but hey, free is free. and yes, 1.25" heims are awesome. here's one compared to a 3/4" heim :D
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By JKMotorsports
#40243
Oh and also, cool Idea for the 1 link w/o a panhard. Never would of thought of that.
User avatar
By 87jeepwrangler
#40309
started bending some tube. one of the greatest articles ever about tube bending, and the method i most commonly use is linked here... http://www.pirate4x4.com/tech/bendin_tube

laying out the main belt bar:
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belt bar finished:
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i typically use a tube notcher for my full scale tube notches, but for tubing this small, i used a computer to print out the notch template
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taped onto the end of tube, traced on, and ready for notching by hand
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finished notches
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User avatar
By taz11
#40481
Sent you a pm.....

Here is a quick sketch of the 2 motors to one jack shaft idea.

The black lines are chains.......forgot to label them :oops:
Attachments
scooter 4x4.JPG
scooter 4x4.JPG (14.13 KiB) Viewed 10422 times
User avatar
By 87jeepwrangler
#40486
rob,

that's similar to what i originally had in mind, but in an effort to simplify things, i considered ditching the "common" jack shaft, and going with two completely separate drivetrains. one for the front wheels, and a separate one entirely for the rear. so each axle would have its own motor and jackshaft.

benefits would be:
  • simplicity (not having to run chains or driveshafts all over the entire vehicle from front to back.
  • safety, again, not having chains or driveshafts all over
  • better battery life under certain circumstances (when just cruising slowly i'd be able to disconnect the power wires to the front motor and use rear wheel drive only, assuming i have "hubs" that i can disconnect)
  • better handling on asphault (this is just an assumption, but i'm pretty sure about it. with the front and rear wheels tied to a single jack shaft, there can be no differentiation between the front and rear wheels. with a separate drivetrain powering each axle, the two axles would be able to move at slightly different speeds when necessary during turns, etc)
negatives:
when running in rear wheel drive only, you wouldn't get the extra power of the 2nd unplugged motor.

still not sure if i like this idea over what you have, but it's something to consider. any input on this idea? i know you recommended 2 motors, but would it make more sense just to get one badass motor?
By bricklayer99
#40499
I have a few ideas that I never put into use, but since your building from scratch I'll throw them out. geared scooter motors to eliminate the need for a jackshaft, split solid rear axle with chain driving one side and an electromagnetic clutch connecting the two halves (like the clutch from a lawnmower pto) that would Lock the two halves at the flip of a switch.
Last edited by bricklayer99 on Sat Oct 15, 2011 2:58 pm, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
By taz11
#40541
If you were concerned about the chains.... you could use 4 MF gearboxes. Then there is no chance of finger chopping and no drive train to run. They use 700 motors. If you swap in the motors linked in my signature (bane bots 18volt 775)
you will end up with more torque than 2 scooter motors will ever give you. Your max voltage would be 24 but it wont really matter. You will need a minimum of a 1000 watt controller to run 4 of them. You could also run 2 600 watt controllers (2 motors each) for even more torque.

Honestly, this may be what you want. The scooter motors are very heavy.

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