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just purchased a Berchet F1 (my first project)

Posted: Mon Sep 28, 2015 6:57 pm
by Gwagon
I have been looking for a Peg Perego Montana and Ranger locally without luck. I have been drooling over Grant's F1 and this bad boy shows up on Ebay and is local to me. This is the ride I really want but never thought would show up.
I am looking into a ESC 24 or 36V scooter setup. This should be fun. I wish I had one of these when I was a kid.

Re: just purchased a Berchet F1 (my first project)

Posted: Tue Sep 29, 2015 4:14 am
by toycrusher
Awesome! Just how big is it? Most bpro's become rollover prone at higher speeds by this one just might be able to handle it! ;)

Re: just purchased a Berchet F1 (my first project)

Posted: Tue Sep 29, 2015 9:09 pm
by Gwagon
toycrusher wrote:Awesome! Just how big is it? Most bpro's become rollover prone at higher speeds by this one just might be able to handle it! ;)
It is a pretty big toy.

length without rear wing is 68"
width is 35"
wheel base is 45"

I think you are right, the width of the car should keep it flat at higher speeds. I look forward to learn how to modify this bad boy from the experts here.

Re: just purchased a Berchet F1 (my first project)

Posted: Wed Sep 30, 2015 6:31 am
by toycrusher
Gwagon wrote:
toycrusher wrote:Awesome! Just how big is it? Most bpro's become rollover prone at higher speeds by this one just might be able to handle it! ;)
It is a pretty big toy.

length without rear wing is 68"
width is 35"
wheel base is 45"

I think you are right, the width of the car should keep it flat at higher speeds. I look forward to learn how to modify this bad boy from the experts here.
There are experts here? :? :lol: :lol: :lol:

Re: just purchased a Berchet F1 (my first project)

Posted: Wed Sep 30, 2015 6:39 am
by toycrusher
On a serious note, take some more pictures, particularly inside the compartments and underneath. We need to see what space you have to work with before a modding plan can come together ;)

Re: just purchased a Berchet F1 (my first project)

Posted: Thu Oct 01, 2015 12:00 pm
by Gwagon
Ok. Here are some photos and some thoughts and questions. Please chime in your suggestions.

here is what it looks like underneath. It is a very good platform for modifying. I think the design is well thought out.
IMG_0104.jpeg
underside
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the rear tray area is pretty roomy 23"long x 5.5" tall x 11" wide.
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rear tray
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what can i put in here?
IMG_0131.jpeg
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The rear axle and front spindles are slightly bent. I will build a new frame using aluminum as this one is not going to handle more power.
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bent axle
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IMG_0091.jpeg
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I am considering using go kart wheels and upgrade the axle from 10mm to 5/8". Would go kart slicks not work well for this type of kids car? The weight would go up. The current rear wheel weighs 6.5lbs.

I am looking at a 750W or 1000W 24V scooter motor to power a live axle. Should I consider a brushless scooter motor or are the standard ones better to use?

The original design only powers one wheel which is strange to me. By the way, I have been enjoying reading the project builds here. I should probably move this over to the projects section. Any input will be appreciated.

Re: just purchased a Berchet F1 (my first project)

Posted: Thu Oct 01, 2015 4:15 pm
by toycrusher
Looks like it was built for a scooter motor and chain drive setup! Probably got cut down to a single wheel by a comittee.

Re: just purchased a Berchet F1 (my first project)

Posted: Fri Oct 02, 2015 6:42 am
by The Eagle
+ 100 Chain Drive, live axle

I've been drooling over this thing for a couple days now. I've never seen one of these.

I think go-kart tires would work great on pavement, but I bet you'll have traction problems in grass with slicks. Then again, that might be pretty fun once your kid figures out how to drift. At least with an ESC setup, the kids usually figure out how to feather it and get moving even when the traction is terrible. I'm thinking hand-brake for the rear tires? :D

Re: just purchased a Berchet F1 (my first project)

Posted: Fri Oct 02, 2015 8:18 am
by toycrusher
What is your budget? There's some pretty sweet ways you can set this up...

Re: just purchased a Berchet F1 (my first project)

Posted: Fri Oct 02, 2015 2:44 pm
by Gwagon
The Eagle wrote:+ 100 Chain Drive, live axle

I've been drooling over this thing for a couple days now. I've never seen one of these.

I think go-kart tires would work great on pavement, but I bet you'll have traction problems in grass with slicks. Then again, that might be pretty fun once your kid figures out how to drift. At least with an ESC setup, the kids usually figure out how to feather it and get moving even when the traction is terrible. I'm thinking hand-brake for the rear tires? :D
I really lucked out on this find.
Live axle. Check. I found some 10mm hardened stainless rods at Mcmasters that will be perfect.
Maybe I'll design the mods using the original wheels and tires first and upgrade later as needed.
It comes with a hand brake for the rear tires now. I'm wondering if I need to add a disc brakes in addition.

Re: just purchased a Berchet F1 (my first project)

Posted: Fri Oct 02, 2015 2:59 pm
by Gwagon
toycrusher wrote:What is your budget? There's some pretty sweet ways you can set this up...
I am thinking at around a grand or so. Let me know your ideas for this budget. What motors would you recommend? I found some 24V 750W scooter motors and 50 or 60T sprockets with a 10mm bore for the axle. Would a single motor be better or a dual motor setup?

Would the original relays to shift from forward to reverse handle the 24V or 36V setup?

I have been redesigning a frame to be able to handle the torque from a scooter motor. It will be made with 6061 Aluminum tubing and plates. I will have to try and keep it light though. Here is a sketch up mock up so far. I am thinking about making trays on the sides of the driver to move the weight towards the middle.

I wish I had this kind of toy when I was a kid.

Re: just purchased a Berchet F1 (my first project)

Posted: Fri Oct 02, 2015 4:04 pm
by toycrusher
You can eliminate chain drive headaches by going with something like these.

http://www.monsterscooterparts.com/36vo10wadidr1.html
Image

http://www.monsterscooterparts.com/24-v ... aQodD3ILXQ
Image

You will need to change the wheels for looks but you shouldn't have a problem adapting the brakes. Pair them with a heavy duty controller and you'll be rockin!

Re: just purchased a Berchet F1 (my first project)

Posted: Fri Oct 02, 2015 5:50 pm
by Gwagon
Thanks for the suggestion Toycrusher. I'll see if I can still retain the original wheels or use wheels and tires in the same size. I want to retain the F1 look.

Re: just purchased a Berchet F1 (my first project)

Posted: Fri Oct 02, 2015 7:08 pm
by toycrusher
Search rzr in the project section and you will find an awesome build by Jonesee using those motors. For wheels, 1/4 midget parts might work well

Re: just purchased a Berchet F1 (my first project)

Posted: Sat Oct 03, 2015 11:19 am
by Gwagon
toycrusher wrote:Search rzr in the project section and you will find an awesome build by Jonesee using those motors. For wheels, 1/4 midget parts might work well
That Rzr is cool and now see how he mounted the motors. I should be able to mount it on my frame. I will pick up a couple of those motors for this build. It should be safer without a chain so that is a bonus.
1000W direct drive motor.png
Here is a photo I found of the motor and gearbox alone
1000W direct drive motor.png (162.02 KiB) Viewed 2870 times

Re: just purchased a Berchet F1 (my first project)

Posted: Fri Oct 09, 2015 10:36 am
by Gwagon
hey guys, I'll continue this thread in the projects section. I have ordered 2 of these scooter motors and have some questions. I'll talk to you guys over at the new project thread. viewtopic.php?f=19&t=18800