Gruber
HobbyMasters
M.L. Toys
KidsWheels
Gruber
HobbyMasters
M.L. Toys
KidsWheels
HobbyMasters M.L. Toys
Gruber
KidsWheels
Need new motors? Grind a gearbox? Adding teeth to a pinion?
User avatar
By CanadianPW
#147683
Hi everyone,

My son has this 6v lightning mcqueen.
https://www.walmart.com/ip/Disney-Pixar ... /118505871

I was researching upgrades on this site before i purchased it knowing that I would like to upgrade to 12v and add a second motor making it two wheel drive. I've upgraded a lil quad to 12v from 6v by adding a new motor/gear from aliexpress and it works great! What i'm not sure of with this lightning mcqueen is if I should add two 6v motors hooked up to a 12v battery or two 12v motors so down the road I could possibly add 18v to them.

Any suggestions or tips would be appreciated.

Thanks.
User avatar
By chart2006
#147689
For the most part there's usually no issues with jumping up to 12v from 6v with the existing motors and gearboxes so as your first upgrade just go straight to 12v - see battery link below. As for upgrading to 18v and adding another gearbox hopefully I can help you out here.

The first problem I see is this is a Huffy ride-on. There's not a lot of experience with Huffy's here and from what I've seen parts are a bit harder to get though not impossible - see potential gearbox options below. Judging by the manual it may use a Safety first /Kids Trax gearbox. My suggestion for now is to remove the gearbox and its cover and take several photos - we need to know the number of teeth on the pinion gear. Also take photos of the cavity where the gearbox is housed. It looks like the gearbox sits outside the housing so the question is with adding another gearbox to the other wheel is there enough axle width? In terms of upgrading to 18v and adding an additional motor/gearbox you may need to take the following in consideration - based on first impressions of the manual:

1. Additional gearbox and motors with correct pinion gears
2. May need a longer axle to accommodate the extra gearbox
3. Need a new wheel hub for the wheel without the ability to connect up to a gearbox (if the rear right wheel is different in terms of mounting the hub than the rear left you may need a new wheel also)
4. Determine how you plan to wire the additional motor, series or parallel or both? If both then you'll need an additional DPDT switch
5. May need to replace the switch in the gear shifter with one designed for higher voltage/amps
6. May need to beef up the wiring
7. Is there space to house the necessary batteries for 18v operation?
8. Are the existing lights/electronics going to accept 18v (headlights, lightning bolts, etc)?

When it comes to the switches, they provide for the reverse, forward, high speed, low speed functionality. To do this one switch switches polarity for reverse and forward while the other switch switches between parallel and series configuration for high and low (12v and 6v based on 12v source). If you don't care to have a low speed then just stick with wiring the motors in parallel . Fortunately when going to 18v you may not need to replace the first gear in the gearboxes with a steel one but when replacing motors you almost always have to replace the pinion since the factory presses them on the motor shaft and therefore aren't easy to remove to reuse. I've seen threads show how to remove them so they can be reused but unless your pinion gear isn't available it's probably easier just to replace it. Keep in mind you need to stay with the same pinion gear tooth count otherwise you'll tear up your first gear.

Here's a suggestion. One of the gearbox links below has a 12v configuration and I think they are being sold as a pair at a really good price. Assuming the hubs will match up to your wheel, so make sure you measure yours, get them and jump up to a 12v battery. Don't worry about replacing the motors already mounted on the gearboxes because if they fry for whatever reason you're not out a lot of money and you plan to upgrade them eventually anyway. You'll of course still need to purchase the additional hub needed for the other wheel (and possibly a longer axle which is just a bar/rod you can buy at a hardware store). As mentioned before if you want 12V to both motors (high speed) wire them up in parallel but remember to wire the new motor in reverse polarity compared to the existing motor otherwise one tire will go forward while the other goes in reverse.

Anyway hope the information here helps you out some.

Potential Gearboxes but check against yours to make sure:
1. 6v: https://www.aliexpress.com/item/Free-Shipping-Gearbox-Gear-Stepper-Motor-Rated-Torque-Long-Life-Gear-Ratio-6-Volt-18000-RPM/32756899137.html
2. 12v (this one may be for 2 gearboxes which is a great buy): https://m.ebay.com/itm/Pair-12V-Electric-Motor-Gear-Box-For-Kids-Ride-On-Car-Bike-Toy-Spare-Parts-US/311962519589?hash=item48a26a4825:g:61cAAOSwb69Zv2S6

Battery:
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00A82A3RK/ref=oh_aui_search_detailpage?ie=UTF8&psc=1

Motor Database Sticky:
http://forum.modifiedpowerwheels.com/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=7832
User avatar
By CanadianPW
#147719
Thanks for detailed response chart2006,

I have attached some photos to give you an idea of what I'm working with.

1. Additional gearbox and motors with correct pinion gears.

Answer: I still need to open up the gearbox and see what I'm working with.

2. May need a longer axle to accommodate the extra gearbox

Answer: It appears there is space to add an additional gearbox/motor to the axle as well as room and a cutout inside the battery compartment. I do require an adaptor to add onto the wheel assembly which I found here.

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/Childre ... c847&tpp=1

3. Need a new wheel hub for the wheel without the ability to connect up to a gearbox (if the rear right wheel is different in terms of mounting the hub than the rear left you may need a new wheel also)

Answer: I believe the adaptor listed above should work with the existing wheel with a little modification.

4. Determine how you plan to wire the additional motor, series or parallel or both? If both then you'll need an additional DPDT switch

Answer: Not quite sure yet

5. May need to replace the switch in the gear shifter with one designed for higher voltage/amps

Answer: Sounds like a smart idea

6. May need to beef up the wiring

Answer: Yes, the current wiring is 18 gauge

7. Is there space to house the necessary batteries for 18v operation?

Answer: Yes, plenty of room under and behind the seat.

8. Are the existing lights/electronics going to accept 18v (headlights, lightning bolts, etc)?

Answer: there are some extra lights as well as a speaker so I will need to modify those to a stand alone 6v battery.

Thank you for all the excellent info as well as the links. Opened my eyes to a few potential issues and problems that may arise.
Attachments
1.jpg
1.jpg (11.36 KiB) Viewed 1504 times
2.jpg
2.jpg (14.3 KiB) Viewed 1504 times
3.jpg
3.jpg (7.64 KiB) Viewed 1504 times
4.jpg
4.jpg (10.81 KiB) Viewed 1504 times
5.jpg
5.jpg (12.96 KiB) Viewed 1504 times
6.jpg
6.jpg (15.73 KiB) Viewed 1504 times
8.jpg
8.jpg (10.49 KiB) Viewed 1504 times
7.jpg
7.jpg (8.89 KiB) Viewed 1504 times
9.jpg
9.jpg (12.13 KiB) Viewed 1504 times
User avatar
By chart2006
#147725
1. Additional gearbox and motors with correct pinion gears.
Answer: I still need to open up the gearbox and see what I'm working with.

Chart: Depending how involved you're wanting it does look like MLToys may have the first gear if you choose to replace it. At 18v you may be ok but just know they probably won't last forever. If you do go with steel first gears you'll definitely want to verify they're the correct one by comparing them with your own gearbox.

2. May need a longer axle to accommodate the extra gearbox
Answer: It appears there is space to add an additional gearbox/motor to the axle as well as room and a cutout inside the battery compartment. I do require an adaptor to add onto the wheel assembly which I found here.

Chart: If you do go with the one from the link make sure the sleeve measurements are the same as yours. The link you provided shows several different hubs and one of them may work with some modification but I do have concerns. My worry is how the rotational force is distributed throughout the wheel hub. If you notice, the original wheel hub sits inside of a cavity or depression on the wheel that's the exact same shape as it is. This helps to better distribute the forces instead of focusing them at the screw points only. Think of how a wrench works, more surface area in the direction of the rotational force provides for better force distribution - less likely to strip the bolt. If it were metal I wouldn't have any concerns but since it's plastic I worry. Needless to say it's something to think about. I tried searching the web for the exact wheel hub but no luck so I ended up contacting Huffy. They provided me with the parts and price information below. It looks like the wheel hub can't be purchased separately but at $13 for the drive wheel you'd get a new/spare tire out of it (or a tire to experiment with) that comes with the hub already mounted to it. If interested just contact Huffy support at service@huffy.com

Drive Wheel ($12.99) PN: 17327-9
Drive Motor ($19.99) PN: 17327-10
Motor Gear Box ($12.99) PN:17327GRBOX

3. Need a new wheel hub for the wheel without the ability to connect up to a gearbox (if the rear right wheel is different in terms of mounting the hub than the rear left you may need a new wheel also)
Answer: I believe the adaptor listed above should work with the existing wheel with a little modification.
chart: See my comment above.

4. Determine how you plan to wire the additional motor, series or parallel or both? If both then you'll need an additional DPDT switch
Answer: Not quite sure yet

Chart: If I remember correctly this particular Lightning McQueen doesn't have a low and a high speed so the shifter is only going to provide reverse or forwards. Now you can, with some modifications, add a low/high speed feature if you want. It wouldn't be integrated into the shifter but you can add it as a "boost" button on the dash which would be pretty cool. If you choose not to add a low/high feature, as mentioned before, just stick with a parallel configuration - equivalent to high speed all the time. If you need help on the wiring just let me know and I'll get/make you some diagrams.

5. May need to replace the switch in the gear shifter with one designed for higher voltage/amps
Answer: Sounds like a smart idea

Chart: Most shifters have a DPDT rocker switch inside. When the shifter handle is moved an arm inside the shifter slides up and down the rocker switching it. You've got two options here. You can either find a high current DPDT rocker switch that can fit in the same location as the current one with minimal modification to the switch mount (this isn't easy) or just get a high current relay and use it in conjunction with the existing switch. The only thing the relay does is allow for a small switch to be used in a high current application. High current automotive relays are about $10 give or take on Amazon. Again, if you decide to do this and need help with the wiring just let me know.

6. May need to beef up the wiring
Answer: Yes, the current wiring is 18 gauge

Chart: 12 gauge would be ideal. I actually just purchase 12/3 extension cords on amazon which work perfectly and it's cheaper than actual power wire if you go with Amazon's in house brand. With the extension cord options you may need to actually cut the wire out of the exterior sleeve, especially if you want to route the wire in the same place the existing wire is, which is what I do but in my opinion it's not a big deal

7. Is there space to house the necessary batteries for 18v operation?
Answer: Yes, plenty of room under and behind the seat.

8. Are the existing lights/electronics going to accept 18v (headlights, lightning bolts, etc)?
Answer: there are some extra lights as well as a speaker so I will need to modify those to a stand alone 6v battery.

chart: The speakers are typically ran off of AA or C batteries so I think you're fine there. The lights and/or sound boxes if there are any may be a different situation so you would need to either run them on a different battery or add a power divider. Id' venture to say the lights would be fine with 12v but 18v or more probably not

High current relay:
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B012N09BFE/ref=sspa_dk_detail_4?psc=1&pd_rd_i=B012N09BFE&pd_rd_wg=YdXTj&pd_rd_r=N9B5NZ9ZT5TX6896M5PY&pd_rd_w=YTuD1

50' 12/3 HD Extension Core:
https://www.amazon.com/TES-SJTW-Heavy-Extension-Lighted/dp/B019GT5G4U/ref=sr_1_16?ie=UTF8&qid=1509732425&sr=8-16&keywords=12%2F3+extension+cord
User avatar
By CanadianPW
#147911
Just a quick update: I was able to open up the gearbox and take pictures.
Attachments
pw 2.jpg
pw 2.jpg (13.35 KiB) Viewed 1442 times
pw 1.jpg
pw 1.jpg (14.76 KiB) Viewed 1442 times
pw 4.jpg
pw 4.jpg (11.2 KiB) Viewed 1442 times
pw 3.jpg
pw 3.jpg (12.44 KiB) Viewed 1442 times
User avatar
By Kaleb
#147989
I really appreciate the work you guys have done so far on this. I have the same Huffy Lightning McQueen and I would love to upgrade to 12v before Christmas. Did you have any success, CanadianPW?
User avatar
By CanadianPW
#147998
I've ordered some new 12V motors and adaptors from aliexpress. Once they are delivered I will give a detailed update with what worked and what didn't. Keep us posted if you do any mods as well!
User avatar
By CanadianPW
#148779
So what I've done so far is add a second 6V motor I purchased from huffy. The only tricky part with this was adding the wheel adaptor. Its just a generic wheel adaptor from aliexpress.

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/Childre ... 0.0.l5FvyB

I had to cut the inside out a bit so that it would fit snug. Then just screwed it on. No issues at all so far. Once that's installed it fit perfectly snug onto the motor.

As far as 6V to 12V, I've wired it up and the results are a bit obvious but on 6V it's slightly slower with the two motors and perfect on 12V. No slipping of the wheels and my son is much happier with the speed. I am going to attempt to wire a switch between 6V and 12V because the speed is a bit to fast for the side walk but perfect for parking lots/park.

I did add an inline 30A fuse and kept the factory fuse however the factory is a mini circuit breaker so it does tend to over heat so that was removed after a few drives.

No other issues with overheating or wiring.

I have some back up motors that are 12V 30,000 rpm vs the 6V 10,000rpm but those are for when he is a little older.

Sorry for the delay, we still have snow on the ground up here. Any feedback is appreciated!
Attachments
pw 1.jpeg
pw 2.jpeg
pw 3.jpeg

Hi im in the process of modding my first powerwhe[…]

Hi these should have enough power to run the jeep.[…]

Kid Trax Manual Request

Do you still have Kid Trax Fire Truck manual?

Got harbor freight 13x5 tires on rim, sawed off th[…]

HobbyMasters Udemy Course